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Legacy Over Litigation: Designing a Life — and Practice — That Lasts

Andy Sykes, Certified Elder Law Attorney and founder of a Pittsburgh-based estate planning and elder law firm, joins Salene in a rare in-person episode to talk about reinvention, legacy, mentorship, and building a practice that serves families at their most vulnerable moments.
From federal clerkship to litigation to a transformative pivot into Medicaid and estate planning, Andy shares how recognizing a knowledge gap changed his career — and gave him back control of his life.
A thoughtful, grounded conversation about facing adversity, protecting families, mentoring the next generation, and why “always do the right thing” is more than just a slogan.
✅ NOTES
Today on The Pivot Playbook, Salene sits down with Andy Sykes — Certified Elder Law Attorney practicing in Pennsylvania, with offices in Pittsburgh (Mount Lebanon) and King of Prussia.
Andy focuses on:
Customized estate planning
Medicaid planning
Asset protection
Estate administration
Special needs planning
Strategic tax optimization
What makes his practice unique?
He began from the crisis side — Medicaid litigation — and saw firsthand how poorly drafted estate documents created devastating consequences for families.
“If people have good knowledge and good advice, they get a much better result than they do without it.”
That realization reshaped his entire career.
⭐ In this episode, we cover:
1. The Pivot: From Litigation to Elder Law
Andy began his career in litigation after clerking for a federal judge and working at a boutique litigation firm where he was handed real cases from day one.
But around the year 2000, a Medicaid case changed everything.
A client had improperly sold her mother’s house while her mother was on Medicaid — costing her over $100,000.
Andy discovered that with proper planning and understanding of Medicaid rules, the outcome could have been dramatically different.
That moment revealed:
A massive knowledge gap
An underserved population
An opportunity to help families proactively
He pivoted fully from litigation to Medicaid and estate planning.
“People don’t understand these rules. If they have good advice, they get a much better result.”
2. Why Planning Over Litigation Changed His Life
The pivot wasn’t just professional — it was personal.
At the time, Andy’s children were young.
Litigation meant:
Court-driven schedules
Trial deadlines
Stress that spilled into family life
Planning work meant:
Greater control of his calendar
More evenings at home
A healthier work-life balance
“When your practice is planning-focused, you can control your calendar much more.”
3. Who He Serves Best
Andy’s ideal clients are:
Middle-class families
Individuals approaching or in retirement
Blended families
Families with special needs children
Clients open to proactive, innovative planning
His work emphasizes:
Asset protection strategies
Medicaid eligibility optimization
IRA tax deferral strategies
Multi-generational trust planning
“We optimize and customize estate plans far more than most firms do.”
4. A Memorable Case: Love, Marriage, and Asset Protection
An older couple found love later in life — but had concerns about:
Protecting assets for their respective children
Nursing home risks
Blended family complications
Through a prenuptial agreement and asset protection trust planning, Andy helped them:
Marry securely
Preserve assets for their children
Protect against Medicaid exposure
Years later, they’re still together.
“It’s great to make it possible for people to feel secure enough to build a life together.”
5. Midlife Perspective & Credibility
When Andy began, he sometimes felt imposter syndrome advising older clients.
Now, with grown children and personal estate planning experience — including special needs planning — he brings lived experience into client conversations.
“I can relate now in a way I couldn’t before.”
Midlife has shifted his focus from annual profitability to long-term legacy.
6. Legacy & Mentorship
For Andy, success today means:
Training the next generation
Bringing on a summer associate
Passing down a thriving practice
“It’s more about legacy now than just this calendar year.”
He emphasizes mentorship:
“You don’t have to reinvent the wheel. Find a mentor.”
7. Facing Adversity Instead of Avoiding It
One of the most thoughtful parts of the conversation centered on adversity.
Andy’s perspective:
When facing professional or personal setbacks, don’t avoid them.
Turn toward them.
He referenced The Sixth Sense as metaphor — what terrifies us may be pointing toward something we need to confront and understand.
“If you can face adversity and learn from it, it becomes a moment of growth.”
8. Ethical, Heart-Centered Leadership
In elder law, identifying the true client is critical.
Often an adult child brings in a parent — but the parent is the client.
This requires:
Clear ethical boundaries
Difficult conversations
Protecting vulnerable individuals
Courage to say “no” when capacity is lacking
“You always have to know who the real client is.”
9. Community & Connection
Andy builds community through:
Live educational seminars
Local referrals
Community visibility
Church involvement
Supporting local music
Hosting estate planning workshops
He also shared an unexpected passion:
Studying improv before the pandemic
Improv, he says, improved his listening skills and presence with clients.
🔥 MEMORABLE QUOTES
“If people have good advice, they get a much better result.”
“When your practice is planning-focused, you can control your calendar.”
“You don’t have to reinvent the wheel. Find a mentor.”
“If you can face adversity and learn from it, it becomes growth.”
“You always have to know who the real client is.”
“Always do the right thing.”
🎯 THE PIVOT PLAYBOOK FOUR PIVOTS
Pivot he’s most proud of:Transitioning from litigation to elder law and Medicaid planning.
Practice that keeps him grounded:Exercise — training for a 10K (The Great Race in Pittsburgh).
Principle that guides him:“Always do the right thing.”
Person who changed his trajectory:(With humor and heart) Salene’s photography — which led him to meet his wife.
🌿 FUN FACTS
Certified Elder Law Attorney
Former federal judicial clerk
Studied improv pre-pandemic
Avid audiobook listener
Favorite show: The Crown
Favorite recent song: “Constant Companion” by Juliana Hatfield
Favorite travel destination: Madrid
Has a wild morning dove named Daisy who visits his deck
✅ CALLS TO ACTION
Learn more about estate planning and elder law services in Pennsylvania:[Insert Firm Website]
Attend a live estate planning seminar in Pittsburgh or King of Prussia.
If you have aging parents — don’t wait until crisis. Plan proactively.
A conversation about security, stewardship, facing hard truths, and building a life — and practice — designed around legacy rather than litigation.
 
 

Never Stop Rowing the Canoe: Law, Leadership, and 786 Songs with J. Scott Bovitz

J. Scott Bovitz — senior partner at Bovitz & Spitzer in Los Angeles, Board-Certified in Business Bankruptcy Law, Fellow of the American College of Bankruptcy, past Chair of the American Board of Certification, adjunct professor, media commentator, ham radio operator, world traveler — and composer of 786 original songs — joins Salene for a wide-ranging conversation about mastery, longevity, leadership, and building a life that blends law, music, teaching, and community.
From launching his own firm in 1991 with his spouse (and still practicing 30+ years later) to recording lawyer-only bands across state lines, teaching generations of law students, and serving in nearly every major bankruptcy organization, Scott shares what it means to stay curious, keep rowing, and never step off your path.
A thoughtful, funny, and deeply grounded conversation about professional reinvention, civic leadership, creativity, and defining success on your own terms.
✅ NOTES
Today on The Pivot Playbook, Salene sits down with J. Scott Bovitz — bankruptcy litigator, educator, organization builder, media spokesperson, and musician.
Scott practices in the Central District of California, representing creditors, landlords, trustees, and distressed businesses in complex bankruptcy litigation. He is Board-Certified in Business Bankruptcy Law (ABC), a Certified Specialist by the State Bar of California, a Fellow of the American College of Bankruptcy, and a past president and chair of numerous professional organizations.
But behind the credentials is a renaissance professional:
Founder of BankruptcyDog.com (a long-running bankruptcy community calendar)
Adjunct professor at Loyola, UNLV, and other law schools
Former member of California’s Committee of Bar Examiners
Frequent media commentator (including national coverage of the Dodgers bankruptcy)
Composer of 786 songs and member of two all-lawyer bands
Photographer who has traveled to 82 countries
⭐ In this episode, we cover:
1. The early pivots that shaped his career
Clerking for his bankruptcy professor before even getting bar results
Being asked — on short notice — to teach bankruptcy at Loyola
Realizing that teaching creates both mastery and opportunity
Choosing a niche and digging deep
“Find a field and learn everything you possibly can. The law is infinite.”
2. The boldest pivot: Starting Bovitz & Spitzer
Leaving a large firm in Century City in 1991 to launch a two-lawyer firm with his spouse.
Negotiating his exit
Managing overhead carefully
Building a litigation-focused bankruptcy practice
Choosing scope intentionally (knowing what not to take)
“When you’re on your own, you decide the scope of your practice.”
Thirty-plus years later, the firm still thrives.
3. Building a reputation through service
Scott estimates that he spends roughly one-third of his time on non-billable leadership and educational work:
Writing and lecturing (hundreds of programs delivered)
Serving on the State Bar’s Legal Specialization Board
Writing certification exams
Serving on the Committee of Bar Examiners
Leadership in ABC, ABI, local bankruptcy forums
His philosophy:
“Don’t just belong. Participate.”
4. Media appearances & becoming a trusted expert
From answering live call-in radio questions to appearing on CBS 14 times during the Dodgers bankruptcy, Scott shares how showing up publicly builds credibility — and how even his mother finally believed he was a “real lawyer” after seeing him on television.
He’s also fielded complex overnight reporter calls (including on 23andMe bankruptcy privacy issues) — often from airports.
5. The music life: 786 songs and counting
It started in 8th grade — writing a song for a girl.
Years later, mid-career, he took UCLA extension classes in recording technology. That turned into:
A home studio in Los Angeles
Two all-lawyer bands
Remote collaboration across cities
Serving as recording engineer
ABA licensing his music for podcast intros
He writes constantly — and rarely declares a song “done.”
“No song is ever finished.”
Music, he says, keeps him grounded and in flow.
6. The power of community
Scott describes the bankruptcy community as surprisingly small — perhaps 300 regular national players.
Whether at ABI, ABC, NCBJ, or local forums, he values walking into a room knowing he has colleagues — and friends.
He also finds connection in unexpected places:
Ham radio (licensed since 1969)
The Los Angeles Lawyers Philharmonic
A lawyer movie club (“Monday Night Lawyer Movie Club — unless it’s on Tuesday”)
BankruptcyDog.com, which he updates daily
“These people who are sometimes your adversaries are your friends.”
7. Advice for younger lawyers
Find a mentor you want to be like.
Choose a field and master it.
Go to programs year-round — not just to meet CLE requirements.
Volunteer and say yes.
Never stop sharpening your sword.
“You never master the law. It’s infinite.”
8. Advice for business clients in distress
Clients often arrive scared, overly optimistic, or poorly informed.
Scott emphasizes:
Listen first.
Assess whether bankruptcy truly helps.
Explain risks and costs clearly.
Be honest when the answer is no.
“Bankruptcy isn’t magic.”
9. Life at 70: How he defines success
Scott recently turned 70 and has no plans to slow down.
For him, success means:
Financial security
A stable marriage (married since 1984)
The freedom to create
Being able to walk into a national conference and know people
Continuing to grow
“You never get off your path.”
🔥 MEMORABLE QUOTES
“Don’t just belong. Participate.”
“When you’re on your own, you decide the scope of your practice.”
“The law is infinite.”
“You never master it.”
“Bankruptcy isn’t magic.”
“You never stop rowing the canoe.”
“Golden rule and common sense — that guides my decisions.”
🎯 THE PIVOT PLAYBOOK FOUR PIVOTS
Pivot he’s most proud of:Launching Bovitz & Spitzer in 1991 and building it into a decades-long practice.
Practice that keeps him grounded:Writing and recording music.
Principle that guides him:The Golden Rule and common sense.
People who shaped his trajectory:
Professor David Luna (first employer)
Frank Riall (who asked him to teach)
Michael Dempsey (litigation role model)
Candice Carlyon (ABC leadership invitation)
✅ CALLS TO ACTION
Learn more about the American Board of Certification:https://abcworld.org
Explore BankruptcyDog.com (Southern California bankruptcy events calendar):http://bankruptcydog.com
Connect with the American College of Bankruptcy:https://www.americancollegeofbankruptcy.com
Learn more about the American Bankruptcy Institute:https://www.abi.org
 
 

Mascots, Math, and Meaning: Barry Gogel’s Pivot Story

Barry Gogel, Managing Member of the Baltimore/Towson office of Rifkin Weiner Livingston, joins Salene for a deeply human conversation about complex business litigation, government procurement battles, service-driven leadership, and the personal pivots that define a meaningful life.
A University of Maryland Carey School of Law graduate, former math teacher, adjunct professor, mentor, and — yes — former Baltimore Orioles mascot, Barry shares how the biggest shift in his life wasn’t about career advancement… it was about returning to education and service.
A wise, funny, and unexpectedly profound conversation about humility, aspiration, community, and why the answer is always no if you don’t ask.
✅ NOTES
Today on The Pivot Playbook, Salene sits down with Barry Gogel — complex business litigator, procurement attorney, adjunct professor, mentor, and community leader based in Baltimore, Maryland.
Barry practices with Rifkin Weiner Livingston, a mid-sized Maryland business law firm with a strong government relations presence. His work includes:
Complex commercial litigation
Government contracts and procurement bid protests
Contract claims against state agencies
Bankruptcy-related litigation and professional malpractice disputes
High-profile regional disputes (including major sports and development matters)
He describes his practice simply:
“When the stakes are big, we step in.”
But behind the litigation victories is a teacher at heart.
⭐ In this episode, we cover:
1. From Math Teacher to Litigator
Barry began his professional life as a mathematics major who always intended to teach.
Inspired by high school math teachers
Began his career in education
Realized the cyclical nature of teaching left him restless
Pivoted to law for intellectual challenge and financial stability
Yet decades later, he returned to teaching — this time at the University of Maryland School of Law.
Today he teaches:
Negotiations
Coaches the ADR team
Sports and the Law
“My goal is to educate and entertain — not necessarily in that order.”
2. The Mascot Years
From 1990–1994, Barry served as a Baltimore Orioles mascot.
Yes — fully costumed.
“What makes a good mascot? The heart of a three-year-old.”
He describes it as:
“The most fun you can have fully dressed.”
The experience shaped his understanding of performance, energy, and connection — skills that translate directly to the courtroom and the classroom.
3. High-Stakes Litigation & Government Procurement
Barry’s legal niche includes state procurement disputes — a small bar of lawyers who challenge arbitrary or unlawful government contract decisions.
Ideal clients:
Businesses with major state contracts
Companies unfairly disfavored in competitive bidding
Contractors willing to fight when the stakes justify it
He also handles litigation that emerges from bankruptcies — especially professional malpractice actions pursued by creditors’ committees.
“There’s no problem so big we can’t handle — so long as you’re not kicked out of court.”
4. A Memorable First Case
Two weeks into practice, Barry took on a pro bono civil rights case through the ACLU involving racial discrimination at a jewelry store.
Investigated discriminatory appointment practices
Litigated aggressively
Settled after key motions
It consumed half of his first year’s billable time — and cemented his identity as an advocate.
5. The Defining Pivot: Returning to Education
The biggest pivot in Barry’s life wasn’t professional — it was personal.
A lunch with former law school dean Don Gifford changed everything.
Barry realized he had drifted too far from education — the space that originally inspired him.
He volunteered to coach the law school’s negotiations team.It didn’t pay.It required enormous time.
He said yes.
That decision grew into:
A formal academic negotiations course
A thriving ADR community
A mentorship network of former students
A long-term legacy of training young lawyers
“It’s great to be happy. It’s even better if someone else is happy because of you.”
6. Service as Medicine
Barry’s involvement with Maryland Youth in the Law (MYLAW) became another defining chapter.
The program:
Places Baltimore City students in paid legal internships
Closes opportunity gaps
Changes career trajectories
He describes asking students to reflect on a moment they were truly selfless — expecting nothing in return.
“You should be selfish in seeking out those selfless moments. That’s the best medicine you can give yourself.”
7. High Aspirations vs. Low Expectations
One of Barry’s most memorable frameworks:
“The key to happiness is low expectations.The key to success is high aspirations.The key to life is understanding the difference.”
He teaches clients — and students — to:
Pursue boldly
Accept outcomes
Not let failure define them
“The answer is no if you don’t ask.”
8. Advice for Business Clients in Distress
Don’t be your own lawyer.
Seek outside judgment early.
Don’t wait until it’s too late.
Temper expectations in litigation.
“Call me before it’s too late.”
9. Ethical, Heart-Centered Leadership
For Barry, leadership means:
Empathy without absorption
Listening without ego
Telling hard truths clearly
Separating your client’s problem from your identity
“You can’t be afraid of the hard truth.”
🔥 MEMORABLE QUOTES
“The heart of a three-year-old.”
“The answer is no if you don’t ask.”
“Be selfish in your selflessness.”
“The key to happiness is low expectations. The key to success is high aspirations. The key to life is understanding the difference.”
“Don’t be your own lawyer.”
“There’s no problem so big we can’t handle — so long as you’re not kicked out of court.”
🎯 THE PIVOT PLAYBOOK FOUR PIVOTS
Pivot he’s most proud of:Volunteering for Maryland Youth in the Law and building a legacy in mentorship and access.
Practice that keeps him grounded:Morning ritual: Wordle, Spelling Bee, Duolingo (Spanish & chess), Boggle with a 15-year Australian friend.
Principle that guides him:“The answer is no if you don’t ask.”
People who changed his trajectory:
High school math teachers
Don Gifford (law school dean)
John Murphy (mentor)
Arnold Wiener (father-in-law and legal inspiration)
His wife, Debra
His children
🌊 FUN FACTS
Former Baltimore Orioles mascot
Mathematics major
Adjunct professor of negotiations & sports law
Owns a Hobie Cat sailboat
Favorite show: Ted Lasso
Favorite music: Jimmy Buffett, Jim Croce, John Denver
Favorite podcast: Lost Ballparks
Two “crazy” chihuahuas named Rice and Beans
✅ CALLS TO ACTION
Learn more about Maryland Youth in the Law (MYLAW):https://www.my-law.org
Explore Rifkin Weiner Livingston:https://www.rwllaw.com
University of Maryland Francis King Carey School of Law:https://www.law.umaryland.edu

Be Brave — Reinvention, Leadership & Authenticity with Hon. Elizabeth A. Gunn

Hon. Elizabeth A. Gunn, U.S. Bankruptcy Judge for the District of Columbia and recipient of the 2025 American Bar Association Business Bankruptcy Committee’s Kathryn R. Heidt Memorial Award, joins Salene to talk about bravery, authenticity, public service, and the pivots that shape a life in law.   She is Board-Certified in Consumer Bankruptcy by the American Board of Certification.
From being bullied in a tiny Oregon town to becoming one of the most recognizable voices in bankruptcy education (including the wildly popular “Bad Boys of Bankruptcy” podcast), Judge Gunn shares candidly about her journey: leaving BigLaw, taking a pay cut for purpose, balancing motherhood with the bench, and finding her voice as a leader.
A powerful, warm, and deeply human conversation about resilience, reinvention, and why the scariest decisions are sometimes the truest.
✅ NOTES 
Today on The Pivot Playbook, Salene sits down with Hon. Elizabeth A. Gunn, U.S. Bankruptcy Judge for the District of Columbia, marathon runner, mother of two, scholar, podcast creator, and the 2025 recipient of the ABA Business Bankruptcy Committee’s Kathryn R. Heidt Memorial Award.
Judge Gunn is known for her intellect, her service, and her creativity — including launching the ABA’s hit series “The Bad Boys of Bankruptcy,” now the most-listened-to podcast in the entire Business Law Section.
But behind the accolades is a story of courage, reinvention, and authenticity.
⭐ In this episode, we cover:
1. Her path to the bench—from a tiny Oregon town to Washington, D.C.
Growing up as the academically gifted “outsider”
Being bullied and persevering
Discovering bankruptcy law through Professor Ingrid Hillinger
Working BigLaw → regional firm → Virginia AG’s office → federal judge
2. The pivotal moment that changed everything
Leaving private practice, taking a massive pay cut, and betting on purpose over prestige — a scary leap that ultimately led to national recognition and her judgeship.
3. Running marathons, building playlists, and her global Starbucks mug wall
How running keeps her sane, what she listens to, and why Berlin and Sydney marathons mark chapters in her personal story.
4. Inside the “Bad Boys of Bankruptcy” podcast
How it started
The wildest stories (Seattle jewel-smuggling fugitives, Dunkin’ Donuts Ponzi schemes, hidden jewelry walls!)
How storytelling makes bankruptcy accessible and engaging
5. What it means to be a first-generation lawyer and a woman on the bench
Authenticity vs. “playing the role”
The “mom finger” for mansplainers
Being the only woman in the courtroom
Raising confident kids while doing demanding work
6. Judge Gunn’s advice for:
Distressed business owners: “Do NOT wait until it’s an 8, 9, or 10 crisis. Come in at a 4 or 5—before it’s too late.”
Creditors: “Open your mail. Participate. The squeaky wheel often gets the grease.”
7. The Pivot Playbook Four Pivots
Pivot she’s most proud of: Leaving private practice + applying for the bench
Practice that keeps her grounded: Being a mom
Principle that guides her: Treat people the way you want to be treated
Person who changed her trajectory: Her mentor, Roy Terry — and her mother
🔥 MEMORABLE QUOTES 
“Sometimes the best decision is the scariest decision. Be brave.”
“I wasn’t successful until I stopped trying to be who I thought a lawyer should be — and just became myself.”
“If they walked in six months earlier, we could have saved it.”
“The bankruptcy code protects the people who show up.”
“Treat others the way you want to be treated — it’s not complicated.”
“This is probably my last job ever, and I love it.”
✅ CALLS TO ACTION
Learn more about the ABA Business Bankruptcy Committee: https://www.americanbar.org/groups/business_law/about/committees/business-bankruptcy/subcommittees/
Listen to Bad Boys of Bankruptcy podcast: 
https://podcasts.apple.com/us/podcast/to-the-extent-that/id1498999428?i=1000737283314
Connect with Judge Gunn’s work through NCBJ, ABC, ABI, and the Federal Bar Association
Learn more about becoming Board-Certified in bankruptcy:  https://abcworld.org
 

The Farm “Debt Doctor” of Kansas: Helping Businesses and Families Rebuild with Attorney David Prell Eron

Episode Description (for Spotify / Apple Podcasts)
In this heartfelt Halloween episode of The Pivot Playbook, host Salene Mazur Kraemer sits down with David Prelle Eron, founder of Prelle Eron & Bailey, P.A. in Wichita, Kansas.
A business bankruptcy attorney, former U.S. Trustee, and board-certified specialist, David shares his remarkable journey from Los Angeles litigator to Kansas farm bankruptcy expert — and how faith, humility, and perspective guide every pivot.
They discuss the power of gratitude, the beauty of second chances, and why “it’s only money” might be the most freeing mantra of all.
🧾 Show Notes
Guest: David Prelle EronFirm: ç (Wichita, KS) Prelle Eron and Bailey, P.A. https://www.eronlaw.net/team-members/david-prelle-eron/  Role: Founder and Managing Partner — Business Bankruptcy, Farm Reorganization (Chapter 12), Chapter 11, and Commercial LitigationJurisdictions: Kansas (Active), California (Inactive)Certification: Board Certified, Business Bankruptcy — American Board of Certification (ABC)Education: University of Iowa College of Law (J.D., 2002)
🔹 Highlights
Founding his Kansas law firm after leaving the U.S. Trustee’s Office — and the courage to create a practice that reflects his values
How Chapter 12 “farm bankruptcies” became his specialty — representing over 50% of all Chapter 12 debtors in Kansas
Why bankruptcy is the most compassionate area of law, helping people rebuild dignity and stability
His mentor’s timeless advice: “Debtors are debtors for a reason.”
Serving on the ABC Board of Directors and launching the Membership Committee to connect certified specialists nationwide
Why running a law firm means mastering both law and business — “Running a firm is not practicing law.”
His personal pivots: from government to entrepreneurship, from lawyer to leader, and from parent to grandparent
💡 Key Takeaways
Perspective is everything. “99 times out of 100, whatever you’re dealing with isn’t the end of the universe.”
Bankruptcy is grace in action. It’s a safety net that lets families and businesses begin again.
Leadership means service. Whether through board work or community faith projects, success is about contribution.
Running a business is its own profession. Master your craft — but also learn to manage, lead, and plan.
Faith and gratitude fuel longevity. Ground yourself in purpose beyond profits.
💬 Notable Quotes
“It’s only money. You can rebuild that. What matters is your health, your faith, and your family.”“Debtors are debtors for a reason — and we’re here to help them anyway.”“Running a law firm isn’t the same as practicing law — it’s a second full-time job.”“I am only here for a short time. Eternity is a very long time.”“Faith, family, and perspective — that’s my definition of success.”
⚡️ Rapid-Fire Highlights
Law School: University of Iowa
Undergrad: Iowa State University
Favorite Show: Seinfeld
Bucket List Trip: Italy — Rome, Florence & Venice with his wife
Best Gift: A heartfelt two-page text from his daughter on his birthday
Recent Trip: Ireland, for the Iowa State vs. Kansas State football game 🇮🇪
Favorite Quote: “Those who cannot remember the past are condemned to repeat it.”
Hidden Talent: Scuba certified — last dove Beaver Lake, Arkansas
Faith & Service: Active in his Catholic parish; performs in annual church musicals raising $150,000+ for charity
Family: 7 children, 5 grandkids (“grandies”), and 2 cats 🐈‍⬛
🎧 Listen & Subscribe
➡️ The Pivot Playbook with Salene Mazur KraemerFresh starts. Turnarounds. Real-life resilience.🌐 www.MazurKraemer.com
#ThePivotPlaybook #MazurKraemer #Podcast #BankruptcyLaw #FaithAndBusiness #Leadership #Resilience #FreshStarts #Entrepreneurship #LawyersOfLinkedIn #BoardCertified #FarmBankruptcy #PivotStories
 

Grace, Grit & Growth: How Attorney Sari Placona Found Her Power — in Law and in Life

In this inspiring episode of The Pivot Playbook, host Salene Mazur Kraemer talks with Sari Placona, partner at McManimon, Scotland & Baumann, LLC in New Jersey, about what it means to rebuild — in business, in friendship, and in yourself.
A bankruptcy and restructuring attorney, IWIRC Rising Star, and fitness powerhouse, Sari shares how walking away from unhealthy friendships, rediscovering strength through fitness, and finding purpose in helping distressed businesses have shaped both her professional and personal pivots.
It’s a candid, empowering conversation about authenticity, boundaries, and the courage to start again.
🧾 Show Notes
Guest: Sari PlaconaFirm: McManimon, Scotland & Baumann, LLC (Roseland, NJ). https://www.msbnj.com/ Role: Bankruptcy & Restructuring Attorney — Chapter 11s, litigation, and assignments for the benefit of creditorsJurisdictions: New Jersey & New YorkRecognition: IWIRC Rising Star Award (2022); Co-Chair, IWIRC New Jersey NetworkLinkedIn: https://www.linkedin.com/in/sari-b-placona-51849147/ 
🔹 Highlights
Career evolution from paralegal to partner, discovering a passion for restructuring law
Leadership in IWIRC New Jersey and the impact of women supporting women
Winning the IWIRC Rising Star Award and mentoring other young professionals
Experience in complex Chapter 11 cases — including Rite Aid, Bed Bath & Beyond, and Mercedes-Benz
How bankruptcy can be a path to renewal, not failure
The bold personal pivot of leaving a toxic friendship group and choosing peace
Sari’s fitness and mindset transformation, building confidence through discipline
💡 Key Takeaways
Pivoting isn’t failure — it’s freedom. Sometimes leaving what no longer serves you opens new doors.
Act early. In both business and personal life, clarity comes through decisive action.
Strength is contagious. When you show up strong, others do too.
Relationships matter. Nurture the ones that support your growth and peace.
💬 Notable Quotes
“You should fill the cups that fill your cup.”“When I feel strong physically, I feel like I can take on whatever the day serves me.”“Be a good person — it’s really that simple.”“You can’t always control the storm, but you can pivot your direction.”
⚡️ Rapid-Fire Highlights
Law School: Rutgers Law
Undergrad: Rutgers University (New Brunswick — Communications & Sociology)
Favorite Shows: The Morning Show (Apple TV), Love Is Blind (Netflix)
Vacation: Greece with family
Best Gift: Whitney Houston memorabilia (and her parents’ unwavering support)
Music: Currently on a Taylor Swift kick 🎶
Workout Routine: HIIT and Warrior Sculpt Yoga
Favorite City: Chicago
Fun Fact: Has a twin brother, Scott, in sports marketing
Pet: None (but grew up with a family dog)
🎧 Listen & Subscribe
➡️ The Pivot Playbook with Salene Mazur KraemerFresh starts. Turnarounds. Real-life resilience.🌐 www.MazurKraemer.com
#ThePivotPlaybook #MazurKraemer #Podcast #IWIRC #WomenInLaw #Resilience #Leadership #FreshStarts #Reinvention #TurnaroundStories #LawyersOfLinkedIn
 
 
 

Tomatoes, Creditors & The Bermuda Triangle: Wisconsin Creditors' Rights Attorney Sam Wisotzkey

In this episode of The Pivot Playbook, host Salene Mazur Kraemer sits down with Sam Wisotzkey, head of the Business & Financial Services Group at Kohner, Mann & Kailas, S.C. in Milwaukee, Wisconsin.  https://kmksc.com/samuel-c-wisotzkey/ Sam shares his journey from Arizona’s desert to the Great Lakes, how he became one of the Midwest’s top creditors’ rights and business bankruptcy attorneys, and why timing, preparation, and relationships matter most in complex financial workouts.
From tomato contracts in California to his great-uncle’s mysterious Bermuda Triangle disappearance, this conversation blends insight, history, and humanity — reminding us that even in law and finance, stories connect us all.
🧾 Show Notes
Guest: Sam WisotzkeyFirm: Kohner, Mann & Kailas, S.C. (Milwaukee, WI)Role: Shareholder; Chair of Business & Financial Services Practice GroupSpecialty: Creditors’ Rights, Business Bankruptcy, Commercial LitigationCertification: Board Certified – Business Bankruptcy Law (American Board of Certification)
🔹 Highlights
Sam’s career path from Phoenix to Milwaukee, and how geography shaped his practice
His 21-year tenure with the firm and leadership in business bankruptcy and creditors’ rights
The story behind a national client and a tomato supply chain — and how quick thinking in a Chapter 11 saved operations nationwide
Board service on the American Board of Certification, including work on the Faculty Committee grading exams and developing new content
The importance of acting early in distressed situations — and how “strike while the iron is hot” applies in collections and bankruptcy
His deep ties to Pittsburgh, where he grew up in the North Hills before heading west
A fascinating family mystery: his great-uncle’s disappearance on the USS Cyclops in the Bermuda Triangle
Reflections on hiking, family, and storytelling as balancing forces in a demanding practice
💡 Key Takeaways
For Creditors: Engage experienced counsel early — delays reduce leverage and recovery.
For Professionals: Certification adds credibility and connects you to a national network of experts.
For Everyone: Approach challenges with curiosity and calm — “hindsight makes even chaos meaningful.”
💬 Notable Quotes
“Things don’t get better with time. Strike while the iron is hot.”“The Bermuda Triangle may be unsolved — but there’s nothing mysterious about the value of acting early.”“Relationships, integrity, and timing: that’s the real formula for a successful bankruptcy practice.”
⚡️ Rapid Fire Highlights
Law School: University of Michigan (Go Blue!)
Favorite Show: The Bear (Hulu)
Movie: The Shawshank Redemption
Vacations: Grand Canyon hike to Phantom Ranch; Glacier National Park
Dessert: Chocolate mousse or any chocolate cake
Best Gift: His two daughters
Music: 80s & 90s playlists
Podcast: Wait Wait… Don’t Tell Me! (NPR)
Favorite City: Amsterdam (and, of course, Milwaukee!)
🎧 Listen & Subscribe
➡️ The Pivot Playbook hosted by Salene Mazur KraemerFresh starts. Turnarounds. Reinvention in business and life.📍 www.MazurKraemer.com#ThePivotPlaybook #MazurKraemer #Podcast #BusinessLaw #BankruptcyLaw #CreditorsRights #Leadership #Resilience #TurnaroundStories #IWIRC #ABCBoardCertified

Student Loans, Storytelling and Second Chances: NC Bankruptcy Attorney Ed Boltz

In this episode of The Pivot Playbook, Salene talks with Ed Bolts, a North Carolina–based consumer bankruptcy attorney who has helped thousands of families reset through Chapter 7 and 13. Ed shares why seeing a lawyer sooner changes everything, how he helped shape the 2022 DOJ/Department of Education student-loan discharge guidelines, and why boundaries and compassion both matter when clients are under stress. They also swap stories about travel, family, and the power of storytelling in advocacy.
🧾 Show Notes
Guest: Ed BoltzLocation: Durham, North Carolina (statewide practice)Role: Consumer bankruptcy attorney (debtors in Ch. 7 & 13); large NC consumer firm (~12 lawyers, ~70 staff)Credentials & Service:
Board Certified bankruptcy specialist since 2004 (legacy; transitioned to ABC in 2007)
ABC Board member; Standards/Recertification committee experience
Student-loan expertise: Contributed to DOJ/Dept. of Education adversary-proceeding guidelines (2022); alt. member, DOE negotiating rulemaking committee
Active with NACBA and related consumer practice groups
What we cover
Ed’s path from Michigan → North Carolina and into consumer bankruptcy (no classes in law school—learned by doing!)
Running a high-volume consumer practice: why paralegal ops matter and how the work is equal parts law + social work
Student loans in/around bankruptcy: how the 2022 DOJ/DOE guidance opened doors, and coordinating non-BK and BK options
Boundaries & burnout: being compassionate without carrying every client’s entire life home
The stigma of bankruptcy and why clients should talk to counsel earlier (before making avoidable mistakes)
A favorite moment: a car-wash selfie with a young man whose family kept their home through a Chapter 13—the “why” behind the work
Storytelling, community, and purpose: Ed’s local storytelling nonprofit (The Monti) and why narrative skills make better lawyers
Key takeaways
Don’t wait. Most consumers would be better off meeting a bankruptcy lawyer sooner, not after doing “fixes” that cause clawbacks/delays.
Student-loan relief is evolving. With the 2022 DOJ/DOE framework, undue hardship cases are more navigable—if you know the playbook.
Compassion + boundaries = sustainable advocacy. Hold empathy, set limits, serve the next client well.
Consumer practice is retail law: systems, staffing, and consistent communication are everything.
Notable quotes
“Most people would have been better off if they came to see a bankruptcy attorney sooner.”“Our clients can drain the emotional well—compassion needs boundaries so we can help the next person.”“I love finding a Chapter 11 idea and translating it to Chapter 13—if it’s good for the goose, it’s good for the gander.”“Bankruptcy law can feel like a magic wand when used well—homes and futures get saved.”
Rapid-fire highlights
Law school: George Washington (GW Law)
Undergrad: Washington University in St. Louis
Streaming: Ozark; currently Hightown
Movies: The Lord of the Rings (also loves classic comedy Blazing Saddles)
Recent trip: A week in Barcelona with his daughters
Dessert: Anything chocolate + peanut butter; signature strawberry-rhubarb pie
Best gift: Great-grandfather’s pocket watch (family heirloom)
Last song: “I’m Broke” — Black Joe Lewis & the Honeybears
Podcast pick: Swindled
Pet: “Nessie,” a sweet Carolina dog
Favorite city visited: Istanbul
Guest links
The Monti (storytelling nonprofit): https://www.themonti.org/storytellers/ed-boltz 
Ed’s professional profile/firm: https://www.billsbills.com/attorneys/edward-c-boltz 
Host: Salene Mazur KraemerPodcast: The Pivot Playbook — Fresh starts, turnarounds, and real-life resilience.CTA: Subscribe on Apple Podcasts, Spotify, and YouTube. Share this episode with a friend who’s navigating debt or a big life pivot.

The Pivot Playbook- Trailer

In this trailer episode of The Pivot Playbook, host Salene Mazur Kraemer introduces her vision for a show that celebrates second chances, fresh starts, and the power of the pivot. Drawing on her 25 years in business law and her passion for storytelling, Salene explores how professionals, entrepreneurs, and dreamers navigate change with integrity and courage.✨ Subscribe for stories of turnaround, purpose, and personal growth — because your next chapter is waiting to be written.

Sewing Threads of Connection: Minneapolis’ Ella Vincent on Mentorship and Meaning in Law"

In this episode of The Pivot Playbook, host Salene Mazur Kraemer interviews Ella Vincent, Senior Specialist Legal Editor for Practical Law, Thomson Reuters, and Chair of the Young and New Lawyer Subcommittee of the ABA Business Bankruptcy Committee (BBC).
Ella shares her inspiring journey from private practice in Seattle to her “dream job” writing and maintaining national bankruptcy and restructuring content. She opens up about her passion for mentorship, her leadership in launching the BBC Match Portal—a first-of-its-kind platform connecting lawyers to writing and speaking opportunities—and her mission to make the bankruptcy bar more welcoming to new practitioners.
From municipal healthcare restructurings to balancing work and motherhood in Minneapolis, Ella reminds us that bankruptcy practice is about more than numbers — it’s about people, community, and service.
👩‍💼 Guest:
Ella VincentSenior Specialist Legal Editor, Bankruptcy & RestructuringPractical Law | Thomson ReutersBased in: Minneapolis, Minnesota
🌐 Professional Affiliations:
American Bar Association – Business Bankruptcy Committee (BBC)
Chair, Young and New Lawyer Subcommittee
Coordinator, BBC Match Portal Initiative
🗒️ Topics Covered:
Transitioning from private practice to legal publishing
Developing bankruptcy and restructuring content for Thomson Reuters Practical Law
The launch and purpose of the ABA BBC’s Match Portal
Mentorship, connection, and growth for young attorneys
The real-life impact of restructuring work — from hospitals to communities
Work-life balance, motherhood, and rediscovering creative hobbies like baking and sewing
💬 Key Takeaways:
“Bankruptcy is not a theoretical practice — it has real-life implications for people and communities.”
“Getting involved early gives clients more options — and better outcomes.”
“Mentorship opens doors and makes our profession stronger.”
🌟 Personal Highlights:
First job: fishmonger — “It taught me customer service, preparation, and knowing your product.”
Favorite dessert: anything chocolate — from cookies to flourless torts.
Favorite vacation: snorkeling with sea turtles in Kona, Hawaii.
Annual tradition: the Minnesota State Fair with her husband and young son.
🔗 Connect with Ella:
LinkedIn – Ella VincentThomson Reuters Practical LawABA Business Bankruptcy Committee
🎧 Host:
Salene Mazur Kraemer, Esq.The Pivot Playbook — Rescuing Business, Redesigning Midlifewww.MazurKraemer.com